Film editor Myron Kerstein had the monumental task of bringing Jon M. Chu‘s two-part film adaptation of the beloved musical Wicked to life. But with actors like Cynthia Erivo (as Elphaba Thropp, the Wicked Witch of the West), Ariana Grande (as Glinda Upland, the Good Witch), and Jonathan Bailey (as Prince Fiyero Tigelaar) at the helm, his job was much easier.
Kerstein says that Erivo and Grande are “two of the best actors and singers on the planet” in Wicked: For Good. And what about Bailey, who was just named People‘s Sexiest Man Alive? “There’s nothing like Jonathan Bailey staring at you every day,” he chuckles. “You’re just wondering, ‘How can this gentleman be this good-looking?'”
The film editor spoke on Gold Derby’s “Meet the Experts: Spotlight” panel about the unique challenges of crafting Wicked and Wicked: For Good as distinct yet continuous films, how the tone shifted from “delight” in Part 1 to “apocalyptic” in Part 2, and how he integrated the two brand new songs into the world of Oz. Kerstein also reveals what his answer would be if Chu ever asked him to take part in a hypothetical third Wicked film.
To date, he has received two Best Film Editing Oscar nominations for Tick, Tick… Boom! (2021) and Wicked (2024), and is now in the running for Wicked: For Good.
Ariana Grande and Cynthia Erivo in Wicked: For GoodUniversal Pictures
Gold Derby: What was the biggest challenge in editing Part 1 and Part 2 as separate entities, since they were filmed at the same time and you had to maintain that narrative timeline?
Myron Kerstein: It was pretty overwhelming, because there was an eight-month shoot and it was 250 hours of footage that was pouring into my edit room. I had to keep two completely different films straight. A lot of editors in episodic [television] have that same experience, but the scale of this project was unmatched. We were telling one story, so the first film had to feel like a dramatic conclusion and worthy of being one movie. When we return to the second movie, we want to continue that journey.
We’re dropping in after many years of being away from these characters, without it feeling confusing. We’re leaving behind the delight, in exchange for a new tone where it feels a bit apocalyptic. That was a big challenge for me as an editor. I had to have a lot of discussions with Jon. I would say to him, “You know, the tone’s quite different, right?” And he was like, “Yeah, everything has gone south for Elphaba, and Glinda has made her choice.” So much of the first film was about choices, and the second film was about consequences.
I looked at these two films like one big saga, no different from watching The Empire Strikes Back and coming back to Return of the Jedi, or having the first book of a Harry Potter film and then coming into the last book. It needed to feel like this big saga, and that we’re telling the greatest love story ever meets The Lord of the Rings. It has to feel earned by the time that you get to the other side of that.
The other side of the rainbow, shall we say.
Yes, absolutely.
If Part 1 had people crying during “Defying Gravity,” how can you possibly prepare them for how they’re going to feel during the Part 2 performance of “For Good”?
Watching the dailies of Cynthia perform “Defying Gravity” was transformative for me as an editor. I’m watching somebody who is so incredibly talented with her craft, and take after take it was making me cry in the edit room. A couple of weeks later, watching dailies for “For Good,” both Cynthia and Ari are moving me day in and day out for that musical number. At the end of the day, what’s so moving about that scene is that we’ve built up this relationship so much that we don’t want to say goodbye. But because of their choices, there’s no way they can ever be together and they both have to sacrifice.
When we were first cutting that number, we had a lot of crane shots and sweeping camera moves. Sometimes I feel like I want to put my stamp as an editor onto something, but at the end of the day, this was a dialogue scene between two people who are saying goodbye to each other. There’s so much emotion in that. Once they go into the closet, it’s so fleeting of a moment of them saying goodbye and I love you to each other. You just want them to be able to hug each other one more time, and you know that they will never see each other again.
Drawing out the silence and emotion in that scene has a certain amount of power. Sometimes I think that the hardest scenes to cut are the ones where every note can feel false. It’s like playing a classical guitar. I can’t hide behind a CG animal or an action sequence. It’s just about two incredible actors working together as one, and then drawing the audience into it.
Jonathan Bailey and Ariana Grande in ‘Wicked: For Good’
The movie also stars Jonathan Bailey. I’m guessing there’s not much work to do when it comes to editing People‘s Sexiest Man Alive. Does he just bring it every time?
Absolutely. There’s nothing like Jonathan Bailey staring at you every day. You’re just wondering, “How can this gentleman be this good-looking?” He can sing and dance, and also, he is the love interest of two characters that has to work. How do we make sure one character feels earned to be able to be with Fiyero. We actually had to carve back Fiyero’s plotline with Glinda because we wanted to make sure that the love interest side of things felt earned with Elphaba. If we lean too heavy into Glinda’s relationship with him, then it’s going to feel like he’s a cad. Johnny is a very unique triple threat where he can sing, dance, and act. And then, of course, he just has that burning edge to him.
Tell us about editing the brand new songs from Stephen Schwartz: “No Place Like Home,” sung by Cynthia, and “The Girl in the Bubble,” sung by Ariana.
Both of these songs were not in the original stage play, so I didn’t have the source material to lean on. I had to make sure that both of these songs earned their right into the film. “No Place Like Home” felt very important as far as Elphaba’s journey about what her mission was. And to have a song that feels antithetical to “The Wizard and I,” where instead of singing about what’s possible for herself, she’s trying to coax the animals into this mission. It’s an anthem. Cynthia Erivo is singing and acting her heart out against empty plates. For a long time, you’re sitting there waiting for a very complicated scene to develop. And of course, you’re changing that editorially over a period of a year where you’re like, is this thing going to work?
“The Girl in the Bubble” is the opposite. It’s told all through mirrors. It’s hidden edits through beautiful camera work, and the sets moving, and visual effects all coming together as one. It’s something that feels very lyrical and still and reflective. One big challenge about that number is, what is the right place to put that musical number? Very late in the game, a couple of weeks before we locked the film, we actually moved this musical number in a bunch of different spots. We ended up trying to understand, where does it feel earned? And for the longest time, it was actually after her fight with Morrible. But we thought it might end up feeling more earned if she’s seeing what’s happening with the March of the Witch Hunters.
If Jon came to you and said, we’ve decided to make a Wicked 3, would you be down for that?
Sure, I’ll go anywhere that Jon Chu tells me to go to. Look, it’s very bittersweet to leave these characters behind. I love them so much. I’m arguably cutting two of the best actors on the planet, in Cynthia Erivo and Ariana Grande. They also happen to be the two best singers on the planet. But I love these characters so much, I would go anywhere with Jon.
This article and video are presented by Universal Pictures.
